The back alley

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A place to sit in a dumpster with your own bottle & moan about the saloon bar

Musha rig um du rum da
Whack fol the daddy o
Whack fol the daddy o
There's whiskey in the jar

Ethics In Journalism[edit]

"Rational"wiki does not care about ethics in journalism. I bring up the Wall street Journal literally taking away money from a charity stream in order to get back at a guy who isn't even extremely right wing, he's just right of center. Now even if you are left wing and can't stand other's opinions you have to agree that's messed up. Apparently the admins in rational wiki don't think so. Their commie friend blocked me for simply saying that. And funny enough he gave the reason that i supposedly didn't "Cite sources" Even though I was just about to cite said sources via an edit. I couldn't do it the first time due to time constraints.
So that's Rational Wiki for you.TheDarkMaster2 (talk) 16:56, 4 November 2018 (UTC)TheDarkMaster2
Is it you or the WSJ who is 'getting back at' the guy - and can you support using the term 'their commie friend'? Bad writing is poor ethics, and RW-ians are not operating as journalists. Anna Livia (talk) 12:54, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Bullshit. Ethan Ralph is FAR-right. Has been for ages. And until I see info outside the rightwing echo shithole (excluding Dexerto which appears to be mostly sane) I remain skeptical of the claims. Now, if all your here to do is notice the fact that RationalWiki doesn't support GamerGate, congrats, they knew that ages ago. ?Comrade GC?Ministry of Praise 13:17, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
GC - I presume you are responding to the original comment rather than mine. :) Anna Livia (talk) 14:19, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
@Anna Livia You presume correctly. ?Comrade GC?Ministry of Praise 15:07, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
Just making it clear in the records - and there is a connection between bad use of language/grammar and thought processes (making allowances for using non-primary languages, variant language usage, writing at speed and autocorrect.) Anna Livia (talk) 23:59, 5 November 2018 (UTC)
You blocked me for not providing citations, of which I was unable to at the time but I was intending to get them once I had the time. Pretty dishonest. And just because people know that Rationalwiki is against Gamergate doesn't mean it's not worth talking about. If that was the case people would have stopped talking about the confederate flag a long time ago.TheDarkMaster2 (talk) 14:23, 6 November 2018 (UTC)TheDarkMaster2
He literally has Commie in his name, dude.TheDarkMaster2 (talk) 14:24, 6 November 2018 (UTC)TheDarkMaster2
Congratulations on noting something so obvious as to be trivial. Might I inquire as to what the fucking hell that is supposed to imply? ?Comrade GC?Ministry of Praise 14:33, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
A gentle reminder that if people are not responding to the immediately previous comment that they make it clear to whom they are addressing themselves. Anna Livia (talk) 14:38, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
@Anna Livia I moved his comments so that they were properly indented, rather than letting the thread go all over the place. ?Comrade GC?Ministry of Praise 14:41, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
You know he was answering her question right? You Have Commie In your name. Oh but let me guess your not a real Communist. Kinda like how The National Socialist weren't Actually socialist despite believing in the strong state. Reminder the Communists killed more people than the National Socialists (talk) 20:09, 6 November 2018 (UTC)Anonymous Ethical
Being a tad pedantic - who is the 'You know' addressed to? And the Communists (of which there are/have been many categories) were around for rather longer and over a larger geographical area than the National Socialists so, IP, you are not necessarily comparing like with like. Anna Livia (talk) 21:01, 6 November 2018 (UTC)
Just so you know an analogy doesn't have to be 100% exactTheDarkMaster2 (talk) 14:29, 7 November 2018 (UTC)TheDarkMaster2
But there has to be a reasonable comparison - regardless of the number of diplomatic passports another state issues the Vatican City State has the highest proportion of diplomatic passports. Anna Livia (talk) 18:08, 7 November 2018 (UTC)
What is a reasonable comparison? — Unsigned, by: / talk / contribs
It is correct and reasonable (and would be legally necessary if the terrorists were based outside the US) to not take donations from terrorists. ikanreed ??Bleat at me 19:13, 16 November 2018 (UTC)

Why do right-wingers pretend that they themselves don't support big government("strong state")? Between Prohibition, Jim Crow, and Tricky Dick's War on Drugs, they never seem to support anything else. Plus, it wasn't exactly liberals that passed the Patriot Act.Phantom666 (talk) 14:43, 10 December 2018 (UTC)Phantom666

n reality most conservatives are in two camps and for both of them, big government means two different things. The social conservatives who don't give a shit about big government in the ideological sense (too much interfering in the market and regulating everything) but instead gets angry when the government does stuff they don't like. In this case, big government really equals bad stuff that conservatives feel oppresses them (though there may be some overlap when the stuff they don't like also happens to involve a bigger government and regulations). The average conservative doesn't care if government regulate factory pollution or capital gains taxes or strict labelling of products. The economic conservative finds regulation and taxes as an interference in the economy, that it creates pointless barriers and gets in the way of the magical hand of the free market. The social benefits of regulations are irrelevant and the social cost should be borne by individuals, not the state. There are, of course, many people who fall in both camps, in other words, big government is an umbrella term for their economic conservatism and their dislike of government and their social policies they don't like. Big government in this case = very bad government. To illustrate the absurdity of the average conservative bitching about big government and regulations, consider the following: Someone is angry about a policy that doesn't even exist, for example taking away guns or not allowing you to pray in a restaurant. No one is coming to steal your guns but the belief that the big government is coming to do it remains. Meanwhile, they show little to no concern with actual big government interference which exemplifies actual government disruption, for example the NSA capturing the data of every phone call, text message, email you send etc., the extremely agressive and oppressive battle with small time marijuana, Nor do they get angry about the spending of obscene amounts of money on pointless and usually destructive military adventures, nor do they protest the government giving huge subsidies to major corporations to build a new office/factory in their town (in fact even economic conservatives are guilty of Hippocratic on the subsidies example). But it isn't actually that absurd, because often by big government we are talking about two different things, big government = them doing stuff i don't like vs. big government = get the fuck out of the market and my monthly salary. ShabiDOO 19:07, 10 December 2018 (UTC)

how do I use this website[edit]

i want to log in but my account's password is a scramble and i don't have ym password database but also i want to contribute but like editing a wiki is kinda intimidating bc it feels like if i give out anythingthat isn't 100% right I'm spreading misinformation and bleh basically what I'm really asking is how do i get over wiki anxiety??? (talk) 02:08, 9 November 2018 (UTC)

If you're unable to login, you should probably bring it up at RationalWiki:Technical support. In the meantime, you should go ahead and try making some smaller edits or creating some pages in the Draft namespace. As long as what you have is sourced and well-worded, you should be fine. Any misinformation can be corrected by other people, and I'm sure they'll be reasonable with you once you let them know you're new. However, you'll first want to get that account sorted. Or else I suppose you can try creating a new one. Pizza SLICE.gifChef Moosolini’s Ristorante ItalianoMake a Reservation 02:30, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
Well if you're not confident about dropping an edit, why not ask one of us if your edit is fine? How do you get over wiki anxiety? Well, be nice and honest to people. They'll be more than happy to guide the way. And you have to edit a lot. Everyone started as a newbie. Why not play around with the sandbox? --It's-a me, Lgm sigpic.png LeftyGreenMario!(Mod) 02:48, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
"And I'm sure they'll be reasonable with you once you let them know you're new." But also get prepared to be personally attacked and insulted as fuck. -Lankaster (talk) 22:51, 9 November 2018 (UTC)
i figured out how to use it. just stay on wigo and saloon bar talk pages and yell at randos (talk) 22:36, 24 December 2018 (UTC)
im confused about the saloon and the back alley, because i dont know how to do the time and worried i may be banned about that, but no one really would do that right? i think its 4 squiggles kkpw (talk) 18:55, 14 May 2019 (UTC)

i did it[edit]

hi its me I finally made an account on this the genious brain hell site (not to be confused with other hell sites like bird hell ) Transbeeism (talk) 23:12, 4 January 2019 (UTC)

Congratulations, you're only a few edits away from not having captchas anymore. (wait, is there some role I can give them to spare them that?) ikanreed ??Bleat at me 19:29, 30 January 2019 (UTC)
@Ikanreed I gave it to them just now, but for future reference, autopatrolled is the manual version of autoconfirmed. —Dorianha Bogelund (talk) 04:49, 31 January 2019 (UTC)

Appeal to memory[edit]

Appeal to memory - assuming that the ability to accurately remember something effects the credence of a claim. this is a logical fallacy because something being true or false is independent of the memory. The claim can still be true even if they misremembered something they used as proof for their argument. Also a claim can still be false even if they perfectly remembered something they used as proof for their argument. No matter how bad or good a person's memory is it is not evidence of proving or disproving a point presented.

Logical form examples:

Person 1 makes a point backing it up with evidence from an event Person 2 does not remember an event that occurs in premise Person 2 therefore person 1 point is faulty (The person's memory is faulty, the point itself has yet to find fault)

Person 1 makes a point backing it up with evidence using data from the internet they remembered incorrectly Person 2 points out that person 1 incorrectly remembered data Person 2 says person 1's point is invalid because of this (The data presented is invalid because it is not the real data from the source. However the point itself has yet to find fault)

Person 1 makes a point that is backed up with evidence from an event Person 2 demonstrates that person misremembered event Person 2 therefore person 1's point is faulty

(The evidence is faulty but the validity of the point has not actually been refuted)

Person 1 has poor memory this is demonstrated throughout the argument Person 2 points out person 1's poor memory and uses it as proof that his argument must be faulty because of it.

Person 1 has very good memory Person 1 uses this fact as proof for his point

(This is the absence of reason and also asserting their proof as memory is unfalsifiable)

Person 1 could not remember their initial point or misremembered it Person points this out and asserts that their argument is invalid because of this.

(Inability to remember their initial point does no affect the credence of the point.)

Person 1 and person 2 are in an argument Person 1 has bad memory Person 2 has very good memory Person 2 states that since their memory is better than person 1 their points are more valid. — Unsigned, by: / talk / contribs

Talk:saloon_bar is usually reserved for super-meta discussion. Discussion about discussion kind of stuff. You wanted plain ol' rationalwiki:saloon bar. ikanreed ??Bleat at me 19:34, 30 January 2019 (UTC)

The time has come[edit]

for a new poll. That old one has literally been up for months, someone replace it already. Oxyaena Harass 06:34, 29 April 2019 (UTC)

I'd like to put a new poll up, but I don't know how. Pizza SLICE.gifDuceMoosoliniYour friendly RW dictator moderator 21:24, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
Neither do I, time to call @D, RW's underpaid handyman. Oxyaena Harass 22:01, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
Just put one on RationalWiki:To do list/Pointless polls. I think Kazitor used to be one of the main contributors to it. —RWRW (talk) 23:45, 29 April 2019 (UTC)
I put up a new poll. Better poll ideas are welcome though. — Dysk (contribs) 19:50, 30 April 2019 (UTC)

How Do You Get to Post to The Different WIGO's?[edit]

I wanted to ask a question about whether an edit/creating a new article under Hinduism was justified but I can't post to the Saloon Bar. Isn't the Saloon Bar supposed to be for posting anything? I thought maybe there might be an article under the Help section but I couldn't find anything. So... is it just the Talk sections then that function as the 'post anything' part? Is the Saloon Bar then for special posts that get promoted from the (hic) posts? How do you get access to the WIGO posts? Do you need to perhaps prove yourself through quality edits and posts? Cumulus (talk) 06:46, 14 September 2019 (UTC)

I believe you need to have been here a bit and made some edits, and occasionally pages get locked once in a while for various reason. AMassiveGay (talk) 07:06, 14 September 2019 (UTC)
Any idea on how many edits and how long? How often and how long are pages locked? What are the various reasons? Cumulus (talk) 08:23, 14 September 2019 (UTC)